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This is an idea I got from Black Magic. May have already been tried out.

This pump uses two pump heads, one is for the main car hydros and the other is for the piston inside of the tank.

As the switch is hit for up, fluid flow from the AUX. pump head flows to the cylinder inside of the tank, forcing the piston to compress the fluid in the tank, which, forcing the fluid into the MAIN pump pickup.

The plumbing of the AUX pump is on the outside of the block, but some can be run into the block.

The black heavy lines under the pump heads are fluid pick ups.

Any comments, suggestions? I see the return from the cylinder will need to be worked out. I could use a dump, again this could be plumbed inside of the block using a second internal dump.
 

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Discussion Starter #2
The AUX pump head is more or less a high flow, low pressure.

I can also see "T" the pickup on the MAIN pump head with a check valve and having the AUX pump head flow with a "T" into the intake of the MAIN pump head too.

Like this:


Remember, it's not how the drawing looks, it's the theory.




.



Last edited by Hydros at Sep 29 2003, 03:08 AM
 

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:uh: so what is the aux pump head pushing the piston inside the tank to force more pressure out to main head to your cylinders :confused: ????????
 

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if so,what if you had 16'' cylinders the piston in the tank aint gonna beable to keep up with a long 16'' cylinder,i maybe wrong not unless there was a internal port on the piston on the inside so it could breath or a really long stroke on the internal piston with a really long tank
 

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just my thoughts but by adding the nitrogen cylinder or pressurizing the oil (like b-magic) the pump head is working less hard and helping the pump head..

but the diagram above looks like you would be doing the same as if the cylinder was never in the tank because it is moving at the same rate as the first pump, therefor never building pressure in the tank.......

correct me if I'm wrong, thats just my quick thoughts as i looked at it... :biggrin:
 

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Originally posted by HydroStangGT@Sep 29 2003, 04:30 AM
if so,what if you had 16'' cylinders the piston in the tank aint gonna beable to keep up with a long 16'' cylinder,i maybe wrong not unless there was
This idea is made for the front for hopping. Tell me more about "a internal port on the piston on the inside so it could breath or a really long stroke on the internal piston with a really long tank".

Thanks for the feedback HydroStangGT
 

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Originally posted by air280@Sep 29 2003, 07:52 AM
wether it's a good idea/possible/practical..............................

my ? would still be

why go to all that effort  :confused:
Pumps are always being improved. I've always though two pump heads are better than one if your motor can handle it.

I guess I could plumb this to use the energy of the spent fluid flow when dumping too.


Check out the pump by Black Magic Hydraulics. http://www.layitlow.com/forums/index.php?s...3&t=65785&st=80

Thanks for the feedback Air280



Last edited by Hydros at Sep 29 2003, 08:49 AM
 

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i think you are better off using the return pressure to pressurise the tank. The are doing it today with a check valve in the direction of the tank...sounds good as long as everything is sealed. Lowrider Japan has very good diagrams but I have not had the time or the energy to take it to translate it.
 

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Originally posted by Volv_lo@Sep 29 2003, 08:37 AM
b-magics is one step further than adding a ton of air pressurizing the tank....    

good thoughts HYDROS   :biggrin:  :biggrin:
Hey Richard,

The thanks for the comments and feedbacks.

Yes, there is air pressure inside of the area of the cylinder, so there will be two things pushing on the large piston. My next project will be how to use the power of the spent return fluid.

I think of it like this: like one big cylinder with a piston pushing and pulling the same fluid back and forth from the two front cylinders. Just that the weight the car helps to push back on the piston (when pulling) and that energy is saved and reused to help re-push the piston fluid back to the front cylinders.

This all means that a reserve of fluid is not needed, as it just gets pushed back and forth.

The thing about having constant extreme pressure inside of the tank, might be that too much pressure would keep the front up, meaning it could not dump. My idea/thoughts are to use one high torque pump along with a second low torque pump. Meaning, fluid is first forced and then acts like is has a constant high pressure.

The only bad thing might be on how it would act when dumping. A slowdown would just get in the way and the return plumbing must be large.
 

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Originally posted by Volv_lo@Sep 29 2003, 08:19 AM
hey tony, you might need to add a check valve in the TANK CYLINDER for release because the pump only turns one way... :biggrin:
I'm glad you found that one. I made it all last night at around 2:30 AM
 

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instead of having the extra pump head why dont you they just pressurize the rear of the tank and when fluid is used by suckin ite out by the pump head the pistion slides over from the pressure of air or nitrogen or somethin of that nature.
 

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I see how it will work Tony,

My problem is that you have two pump heads, MORE PROBLEMS...'

but really I can't describe what I'm trying to say here.... So I'll have to come back to this...

kinda like this tho..
you would have one pump removing fluid from the tank to press the cylinders, and one pump removing fluid to basically keep a constant force on the inlet ports of the first pump head...

Now I think timming would be a bitch and you will need to consume the same amount of volume in the rear in tank cylinder as you would in the combined front suspension cylinders... if the bore of the in tank rear cylinder is greater than the suspension cylinders, then it will move slower, so the AUX pump head would def. have to be geared for more flow... thus fucking up the timming big time.... and if its too slow you'd cavitate the first pump head, if its too fast you'll blow up the res tank....

JUST MY THOUGHTS HERE, I'll have to revisit this topic as my brain clears up from this crazy but potentially breakthru system....
 

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Originally posted by nissanminitrucker@Sep 29 2003, 10:23 AM
instead of having the extra pump head why dont you they just pressurize the rear of the tank and when fluid is used by suckin ite out by the pump head the pistion slides over from the pressure of air or nitrogen or somethin of that nature.
This is already being done and works very good. You just use an air compressor to compress air behind the piston then when you hit the switch and the fluid starts to move the compressed air pushes forwards to fill the emptying space and forces fluid ythrough the pumphead. My buddy did this to his car and it now takes half the hits it did to get it on the bumper so that alone will extend the life of your motors and lessen the need to charge batteries. If anyone is interested we can get these made for you.

I wouldnt go the route of two pumpheads and a piston in the tank and all the extra plumbing etc. Your just adding extra parts that can cause possible problems for you.
 

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Originally posted by impalapartz+Sep 29 2003, 09:39 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (impalapartz @ Sep 29 2003, 09:39 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteBegin--nissanminitrucker@Sep 29 2003, 10:23 AM
instead of having the extra pump head why dont you they just pressurize the rear of the tank and when fluid is used by suckin ite out by the pump head the pistion slides over from the pressure of air or nitrogen or somethin of that nature.
This is already being done and works very good. You just use an air compressor to compress air behind the piston then when you hit the switch and the fluid starts to move the compressed air pushes forwards to fill the emptying space and forces fluid ythrough the pumphead. My buddy did this to his car and it now takes half the hits it did to get it on the bumper so that alone will extend the life of your motors and lessen the need to charge batteries. If anyone is interested we can get these made for you.

I wouldnt go the route of two pumpheads and a piston in the tank and all the extra plumbing etc. Your just adding extra parts that can cause possible problems for you.[/b][/quote]
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