LayItLow.com Lowrider Forums banner
1 - 19 of 19 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,732 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
hey guys. im no audio expert, but ive owned and installed my fair share of car stereos and subwoofers. i have a new project in which i want the ultimate sound system.

ive noticed in all my prior stereos, the woofers hit certian notes a lot harder than others. how can i have a system that can equally and clearly cover all notes of the bass spectrum. how is this achieved?
 

·
2GUNZ
Joined
·
28,221 Posts
hey guys. im no audio expert, but ive owned and installed my fair share of car stereos and subwoofers. i have a new project in which i want the ultimate sound system.

ive noticed in all my prior stereos, the woofers hit certian notes a lot harder than others. how can i have a system that can equally and clearly cover all notes of the bass spectrum. how is this achieved?
I guess trying to undestand what you mean about the bass spectrum. That could be TWO trains of thought.
The first being SUBWOOFERS. The perscribe range for bass starts at 20 hz, though there have been some that have been able to get lower, into 17hz. But typically much of the info below 20hz is not audible with standard car stereo equipment. A typically Sealed enclosure is running about 50-60 hz, or around there With Porting you can better control the lower frequency output which will give you deeper Bass, alot of people use 31 hz, I had 2-12" Rockford tuned to 27hz, and it was pretty massive.

Then you have MID WOOFERS
They typically run from 60-80 hz. Are smaller in size, typically a 8" sub but most of the time, your looking at 6 1/2". The biggest problem with Mid Woofers is the Enclosures that hold them. Most are not able to get a standard enclosure in there, so the response is neveer at a prescribe range. They can run from 60-120hz, and sometimes upward into 180-250hz, depending on the enclosure, and that tends to really give you nasty bumb in your frequency curves.

So it just depends on what you are talking about. And of course there is a WHOLE lot more about this, just trying to give a BASIC example of numbers. Maybe some more of what you are trying to do.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,022 Posts
hey guys. im no audio expert, but ive owned and installed my fair share of car stereos and subwoofers. i have a new project in which i want the ultimate sound system.

ive noticed in all my prior stereos, the woofers hit certian notes a lot harder than others. how can i have a system that can equally and clearly cover all notes of the bass spectrum. how is this achieved?
What type of enclosure do you have? Generally speaking a sealed box will give you a smooth response curve, and a high tuned ported box will be very peaky but more output. A low tuned ported box(<35hz) should sound very good but still have a lot of output. Also, remember that when using a ported enclosure it can harm the sub if you play notes lower than the tuning of the box(going subsonic)
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
349 Posts
tune the box with the port,the music you play will effect the the tuning,,when i tune a box im building it goes rap=34 to 40hz,spanish=48 to 56hz,metal and old school=38 to 45hz and on
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,007 Posts
As stated: sealed enclosures are generally tighter, accurate bass but limited in reproduction of steep low end roll off(really low fart bass). Ported great in low end roll off tends to be more sloppy, by sloppy (and this is my interpretation) when the music has a bass note it seems to be prolonged in when it actually hits hence the sloppiness. Band-pass enclosure when built correctly (and its not always easy to build) can play a range, say 30-100hz and you'll see high gains in those ranges of bass notes and others out side of that range will fallout which is the intention of a band-pass box. Also as Dirty stated: you'll want to buy a sub that has a good range and it's F-Center or FS resonance frequency of the driver. In free-air, the driver's impedance will peak at this frequency is also noteworthy.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,732 Posts
Discussion Starter · #7 ·
i really really appreciate all the good info.... :) can someone give me an idea of what i should put in my trunk to cover all frequencys of the bass spectrum? i dont care if i have to run multiple sized subwoofers in different boxes.... i.e. would it be smart to have 2 12"s in a ported box and 2 8"s in a sealed box? that way id cover all notes, right? i want the perfect system for my next car, im so tired of all my subwoofers in my different stereos covering such a small portion of the bass spectrum.

i guess basically what i want to know is how do i hear it all? and i really am not trying to spend more than like $2,000 on my entire system, is that reasonable?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,007 Posts
No, you'll want to stick with one size of woofer and either ported or sealed. Sealed will be more precise verses ported being able to get lower but having some sloppiness. How much you are willing to spend on first security (which no one ever does), next amps, subs, and head-unit. What do you already have?
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
8,366 Posts
i really really appreciate all the good info.... :) can someone give me an idea of what i should put in my trunk to cover all frequencys of the bass spectrum? i dont care if i have to run multiple sized subwoofers in different boxes.... i.e. would it be smart to have 2 12"s in a ported box and 2 8"s in a sealed box? that way id cover all notes, right? i want the perfect system for my next car, im so tired of all my subwoofers in my different stereos covering such a small portion of the bass spectrum.

i guess basically what i want to know is how do i hear it all? and i really am not trying to spend more than like $2,000 on my entire system, is that reasonable?
Dude....

What kind of music do you REALLLLLLY love??

Are you looking for just LOUD bass with little/NO highs??
If SQ is a priority expect to spend MOOORE.

Im NOT trying to be an ass but that is VERY important.

Sealed = PUNCH = kick drum (i.e. rock some pop etc)

Ported/bandpass etc = lower freq. (rap hip hop etc0

If security isnt a role....

AMPS...SPEAKERS....HEADUNIT....INSTALL.



Im RE-Pete.



The above posters are my brothers PETE
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
8,366 Posts
What type of enclosure do you have? Generally speaking a sealed box will give you a smooth response curve, and a high tuned ported box will be very peaky but more output. A low tuned ported box(<35hz) should sound very good but still have a lot of output. Also, remember that when using a ported enclosure it can harm the sub if you play notes lower than the tuning of the box(going subsonic)
By the way...

I just found out my amp has a subsonic filter.

Pretty good to keep the sub from being unloaded at volume.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,732 Posts
Discussion Starter · #11 ·
i have not bought anything yet.

i like reggae and hip hop/rap

but the point of this post is asking the question if it is possible to have a system that can clearly, accurately, and powerfully cover the ENTIRE spectrum of bass frequencies? or am i just a foolish dreamer?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,732 Posts
Discussion Starter · #12 · (Edited)
is a bandpass enclosure the solution to all of my problems?

or maybe the solutions is using both subwoofers and midwoofers? typically what kind of enclosure would be used for midwoofers?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
8,414 Posts
The characteristics of the particular driver play a big role in the frequency response. Generally, smaller woofers are better at upper sub-bass freqs, while larger woofers are better at handling lower sub bass frequencies. That is more of a guideline than a rule. With todays drivers, its almost not even so much of a guideline, as much as it is a trend.


With the use of any common free enclosure design program, you can input a particular drivers small-theile parameters, and the design of the enclosure, and get an idea of any bad runoffs or spikes you may have. Of course on paper, and in a car, are two different things. Recommendations from the manufacturer and consumers with experience with that particular driver are good starting points.

I've never had a flat response with ported enclosures, but if you love low bass, you can get a nice sounding system hits hard down low, and slowly tapers off into the mid bass region. At that point its up to you whether you want add midbass drivers to your system, or component woofers that will get in the 70-150 hz region. Ive had a few different setups using ported 8" subwoofers, and the response is very acceptable, and always very close to what the design program said it would be. A system tuned to 30-35 hz is going to be loudest at 40-45hz, and will play down to 30-35hz. just make sure you verify the manufactures specs and recommendations before tuning a 6" sub to those frequencies and expecting good results. Bass much lower than that isnt common, 20hz bass is just a novelty more than anything. (although I do recommend steep subsonic crossovers for ported boxes just to be safe, especially with todays goofy producers)

Bandpass enclosures are not even an option for music in my opinion. Sealed enclosures are typically going to have a flatter response than ported enclosures, but sometimes its hard to predict a 'boominess' that may occur, and the low end almost always suffers. I'll take sloppy bass over boomy bass any day. 150dBs of 40hz bass is going to seem a lot louder than 150dBs of 70hz, without irritating your ears as much. Thats one reason the simple ported design has stood the test of time. The other being that ported enclosures are more efficient, both in power requirement, and output.

As long as the enclosure matches the driver, and what you are trying to accomplish, simple ported is almost always the most enjoyable subwoofer type there is. The best thing to do it find what kind of dimensions you have to work with, and narrow down your woofer selection based on that. You have a better chance skimping out on the driver (woofer) than you do skimping on enclosure design, but thats not to say you can't end up with a custom vehicle specific fiberglass enclosure than only a handful of drivers will work good in (I miss round Solobarics :rolleyes: )
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,932 Posts
hey guys. im no audio expert, but ive owned and installed my fair share of car stereos and subwoofers. i have a new project in which i want the ultimate sound system.

ive noticed in all my prior stereos, the woofers hit certian notes a lot harder than others. how can i have a system that can equally and clearly cover all notes of the bass spectrum. how is this achieved?
i know exactley what you mean!

i just built my system and i wanted some of the same requirments you have here.

i speced and tuned my boxes to 32hz
faced sub and port at the rear seat.
im runin twin boxes with one 12 in each and two one thousand watt amps runing them

it rolls thru the freq realy nice! but some freq hardley rattle my mirrors while outhers at even half volume on the deck it makes my CD player skip it hits so hard.

it got me thinkin that posibly what that note is, is a resonant harmonic with my car. its the right wavelength to cause an extra "umpf" that the speaker itself is not necisarily producing on its own.
if that be the case it is posibly unavoidable. however you could posibly offset the speaker positions in your car as to cut down on them from doing this, but i dont see why realy. its good for bass demos in your stereo when ya find songs that knock at that freq :cool:

just my 2 bits
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,732 Posts
Discussion Starter · #15 ·
The characteristics of the particular driver play a big role in the frequency response. Generally, smaller woofers are better at upper sub-bass freqs, while larger woofers are better at handling lower sub bass frequencies. That is more of a guideline than a rule. With todays drivers, its almost not even so much of a guideline, as much as it is a trend.


With the use of any common free enclosure design program, you can input a particular drivers small-theile parameters, and the design of the enclosure, and get an idea of any bad runoffs or spikes you may have. Of course on paper, and in a car, are two different things. Recommendations from the manufacturer and consumers with experience with that particular driver are good starting points.

I've never had a flat response with ported enclosures, but if you love low bass, you can get a nice sounding system hits hard down low, and slowly tapers off into the mid bass region. At that point its up to you whether you want add midbass drivers to your system, or component woofers that will get in the 70-150 hz region. Ive had a few different setups using ported 8" subwoofers, and the response is very acceptable, and always very close to what the design program said it would be. A system tuned to 30-35 hz is going to be loudest at 40-45hz, and will play down to 30-35hz. just make sure you verify the manufactures specs and recommendations before tuning a 6" sub to those frequencies and expecting good results. Bass much lower than that isnt common, 20hz bass is just a novelty more than anything. (although I do recommend steep subsonic crossovers for ported boxes just to be safe, especially with todays goofy producers)

Bandpass enclosures are not even an option for music in my opinion. Sealed enclosures are typically going to have a flatter response than ported enclosures, but sometimes its hard to predict a 'boominess' that may occur, and the low end almost always suffers. I'll take sloppy bass over boomy bass any day. 150dBs of 40hz bass is going to seem a lot louder than 150dBs of 70hz, without irritating your ears as much. Thats one reason the simple ported design has stood the test of time. The other being that ported enclosures are more efficient, both in power requirement, and output.

As long as the enclosure matches the driver, and what you are trying to accomplish, simple ported is almost always the most enjoyable subwoofer type there is. The best thing to do it find what kind of dimensions you have to work with, and narrow down your woofer selection based on that. You have a better chance skimping out on the driver (woofer) than you do skimping on enclosure design, but thats not to say you can't end up with a custom vehicle specific fiberglass enclosure than only a handful of drivers will work good in (I miss round Solobarics :rolleyes: )

i had a 85 caprice station wagon with 4 2ohm kicker comp cvr 12"s in 2 manufacture ported boxes, and it knocked soooooooo hard on low notes and hit mid notes well, it just couldnt even pick up high notes.

could i use that same setup, with some 8" mid woofers to pick up the higher bass notes? and i was thinkin of putting the mid woofers in the rear deck of the car....

will that work?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
10,429 Posts
use subs for what they were meant for.. low frequency reproduction.... invest in some strong midbass and midrange drivers and install them properly.... go active and adjust freq's and cutoffs to coincide with your tastes and the speakers in the system.....
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,732 Posts
Discussion Starter · #17 ·
use subs for what they were meant for.. low frequency reproduction.... invest in some strong midbass and midrange drivers and install them properly.... go active and adjust freq's and cutoffs to coincide with your tastes and the speakers in the system.....
yeah i think i just need to fuck with some mid bass drivers, what is the proper way to install them? do you put them in the trunk or inside the cabin of the vehicle? is it necessairy for a box? and what kind of box do you use, sealed or ported?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,022 Posts
yeah i think i just need to fuck with some mid bass drivers, what is the proper way to install them? do you put them in the trunk or inside the cabin of the vehicle? is it necessairy for a box? and what kind of box do you use, sealed or ported?
glass them into the doors for an infinite baffle enclosure
 
1 - 19 of 19 Posts
This is an older thread, you may not receive a response, and could be reviving an old thread. Please consider creating a new thread.
Top