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Discussion Starter #1
Hello to all everyone here
I am new here and at all about lowriders. Does anyone know some complete guide or howto for lowriders? I am form Bulgaria and there are no such cars or anyone knowing them here. I do not want to bother you and waist your time with stupid questions, so please let me know if I could find any basic info about construction and how the lowrider setup works.
I want to install airbags in old Russian car called Moskvich (Moscow citizen). The car is made in 1967. It is 1200 kg /about 2500 lbs total weight. The size is like VW Jetta. It has springs and shock absorbers in front and leafs and shock absorbers on back. What do you think would be the appropriate setup? If you have some questions just ask me, I don’t know what info is necessary.
Thanks a lot
Ivo
I will try to post some pics
 

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Hello Ivo

I'm not sure that anyone in America would know about these cars. There are a couple that I have seen at shows here in the UK, but they are very scarce.

I would recommend that you also join the Max Hydraulics forum here in the UK ( http://www.lowriderforums.com/forums/ ) as it is a lot closer to you. The person who runs the forum is the UK's leading air suspension and hydraulics specialist.

If you just want to lower your car you can simply fit shorter front springs (or cut the old ones) and have lowering blocks at the rear. The lowering blocks at the rear go between the top of the leaf spring and the bottom of the axle which raises it in relation to the car's body.

Mike

PS- Some good Moskvitch pictures here: http://digilander.libero.it/cuoccimix/ENGL...usse5(azlk).htm

:)
 

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:cheesy:
 

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Discussion Starter #4
Hi Mike,
Thanks for the advice.
I have bought one the same as on the picture yesterday. It was less than $150…, we have many of them… :biggrin:
I know that may be no one here have seen this type of car… so it will be interesting for you?
I want FBSS :) not just lowering the car ;)
The suspension of this car is very similar to the 60’ impalas as I seen on pictures around so I think it will not be a big deal installing it.
Does the psi I should use depend on the car weight?
Thanks
 

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Hello

It's always interesting to see cars from the former Soviet Union. Not many of them make it all the way over to the UK although I understand that there are quite a lot of them in eastern Europe.

Right, so it looks as if you will be needing either hydraulics or air suspension, so it isn't just a basic lowering job. The '60s Impalas have coil springs all round, but your car can still be converted to air suspension or hydraulics. I don't know much about hydraulics so you will need to have a look in the hydraulics forum to learn about it.

Here is a good site for learning about air suspension: http://www.ridetech.com/. Just so you can get an idea of what type of set-up you will need for air suspension, you will need something like this at the front: http://www.ridetech.com/productinfo/coolride.asp, and this at the back:
http://www.ridetech.com/productinfo/airoverleaf.asp.

The psi does depend on the car weight, and the pressure at the front will be higher than at the back because of the weight distribution. So you might have 100psi at the front and 70psi at the back, just as an example.

The pressure that you will run in your air tank will be about 150psi, so that will be enough to lift any car. You control the pressure with your switches inside the car and only put as much air pressure into each end of the car as you need. You can tell how much you are putting into each air spring because you will have pressure gauges which read the pressure from the line to each air spring.

For FBSS you need a 4-path system which means that you have individual control over all four corners of the car.

Mike
 

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Discussion Starter #6
Hi Mike,
This is very useful info for me, thanks.
I plan to remove the leaf suspension from the back and replace it with one from newer model which is with springs. They did not change Moskvitch since 60’ a lot :) the late 80’ looks almost the same :) I will go air not hydros… as it is my first try :)
What does determine how low the car could go? Is it like the height of car without the springs? Laying on bump stops?
Thanks,
Ivo
I tried to attach some pics but it does not work… :uh:
 

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Hey Ivo,
yes you are correct,the drop of the car is determined by when the travel of the axle of trailing arm fouls on the chassis or bump stops. The height from the floor can also be changed by what size wheels and tyres you use. The smaller diameter wheel and tyre combo,the lower the car will sit anyway.
 

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Also, one important thing to remember with air springs is that you want the suspension to bottom out JUST BEFORE the air springs are fully compressed. If you have the air springs bottoming out before the suspension is on its bump stops you will crush the air spring and most probably wreck it.

The things that determine all that are the air spring mountings, which are quite often made out of thick-wall tubing (see the pictures I linked you to). Because the air spring is shorter than the original coil spring you have to make up the difference in height with the new mountings.

Mike
 

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Discussion Starter #9
Hi guys,
I worry about wire rims. I see there is adapter that should be put on the brake drums. When I install wire rims they would go out of the fender or I am wrong?
thanks,
Ivo
 

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Ivo,

The offset of the wheels will be close to the standard offset unless you go for reverse rims.

You need to measure the offset of your wheels, then compare that with the manufacturer's details of whatever wheels you are looking at.

I'm not sure that wire wheels would suit your car though, but that is down to personal choice!

Mike
 

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i say that as long as you can explain and post up pictures, get on the different forums on here and ask away. people are usually willing to give their advice to people in need. im sure people in the air susension forum (including myself) wouldnt mind :thumbsup:
 

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This one doesn't work properly. I can't see what significance the Bruce Willis video has anyway. I tried it with several different videos and it still wouldn't work.

Mike
 

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Discussion Starter #17
Hi guys,
Thanks for replays. :) Soon I will bring the car in my garage and post some pics.
Is there an option to have something like preset height of the car with bags? Like bottom low, middle height for driving and as high as possible or I should adjust it by myself every time by swithces?
I attached the schema of the front suspension. My one is the one with drum brakes and I plan to replace it with the one with disk brakes, they do not doffers a lot. The good think in Russian cars is that they did not change a lot since 60’ :biggrin: Do you think it is possible to put bags in it?
Thanks,
Ivo
 

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Ivo

It is possible to have a set-up with preset height adjustments but it is very expensive and I'm not sure if it actually works that well. Nearly everyone adjusts their suspension manually.

What you need to do is have your air springs inflated to their design height (usually about half way between compressed and fully extended) when your car is at the height you want it to be for everyday driving. This is determined by the depth of the spring mountings. For example if your car turns out to look higher than you wanted when it is riding nicely, then when you lower it so it looks good, but isn't driving nicely, then it means that your spring mountings are too deep. What you do is have shorter mountings which will bring the car height down to where you want it, but the spring is still inflated to its design height.

Once everything is set-up properly and your car is riding well at your chosen driving height you simply remember the pressures, as shown by your pressure gauges, then inflate your suspension to those pressures each time and you will be at the right height!

It is important that you have your tracking (wheel alignment) set when your car is at its driving height. If you have it set with the suspension too low or too high for normal driving it will cause problems with tyre wear if you then start driving around at a different height from when the tracking was adjusted.

Looking at your suspension diagrams there appears to be plenty of room for converting to air suspension. On most cars with your type of suspension you have to trim back some of the metal crossmember where the air spring goes up into the original coil spring tower.

Your new front shock absorbers will probably need to go in front of the crossmember, between the coil spring tower and the lower suspension arm. This is because the steering arms are at the back, so would be in the way. It looks as if you have no anti-roll bar to worry about, so that is good!

Mike
 
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